It has factory size tires 275/55/20. When cutting the JMBX open, converter rebuilders report that a high percentage of units show extreme damage due to the clutch piston and front cover crashing into each other (Figure 1). Engine speed: Directly affects shift scheduling, Torque Converter Clutch (TCC) control, line pressure, and transmission diagnostics. The General Motors 6L80-E & 6L90-E transmissions are among the most diverse and capable transmissions of their time; being used in everything from exciting muscle cars to family SUV's. In this Drivetrain 101, we'll analyze all of its most prolific problems, solutions and upgrades. For now, the bulk of reported cases are related to diesel vehicles. And Sonnax doesnt even offer a forged clutch piston for the TMBX there just isnt any demand for one. If we change to the latest GM 10-speed automatic it has a 4.70:1 First gear and is factory matched with a 2.85:1 rear gear. Finally I am looking for a Chevrolet Caprice PPV to build into a fun road trip sedan for the family with either a LS3 or L92 engine block, stock LSA crank, rods, pistons, ARP hardware through out with CNC LS3/L92 heads and a pair of turbos with a goal of 750-950 horsepower at the wheels. Powerglide (bellhousing pattern - Chevrolet, Fit-all), TH350 (bellhousing pattern - Chevrolet, BOP, Fit-all), TH400 (bellhousing pattern - Chevrolet, BOP), TH200-4R (bellhousing pattern - BOP, Fit-all), TH700-R4 /4L60 (bellhousing pattern - Chevrolet). Statements on 6L80E trans with LS engine. The stator shaft support housing comes with these gears as one assembly. Ninth 0.69 Electronic challenges exist when mixing and matching the 6L80 as they must be matched to their particular engine. Change Your Address, Yes, I would like to receive emails from Gears Magazine. The OE cover and piston are damaged to the point of not being reusable this is where all of the metal you find in the transmission comes from! You are browsing camaro6. How quickly time passes by. Also since the transmission is different the gearing and tuning are naturally different. When its enabled at low speeds the exhaust tone becomes muffled, the AFM valves clatter open and closed, v4 vibration and increased injector noise is nothing but annoying, especially with a convertible. NonStop-Transmission. Second 2.99 check the starter bendix and see if its loose and bouncing off the flywheel. At times the 10-speed transmission may skip gears when the vehicle starts from a complete stop. Wait 2 seconds. and can weigh up to ~230 lbs. Its like wheres Waldo. They dealership gave Brian their opinion of what was making the noise. Developing any new technology will cost an absolute ton of money, which why its not unusual for car companies to co-develop things like chassis and transmissions. The CIDAS (Casting Integrated Direct Acting Solenoid) are all normally low solenoids. Both 2wd and 4wd versions of the 6L80 can be used equally well, and there are no inherent advantages to either one once you have installed our adapter assembly. Bolt and gasket inlcuded. RECALLS! * An extension housing p/n 8673406 (old p/n 24214689) is available for the TH700R4/4L60 transmission that moves the rear transmission mount to the same position as a TH400 (short-style 4" tail) or TH200-4R transmission. The GM 10L80/90 transmissions began production in 2017, meaning that were closing in on six years of this transmission being on the road. Account. In a similar vein, GM Gen. IV engines do not always take kindly to other transmissions such as manuals (essentially no longer available from GM), and most automatics that predate the 6L80. 3-Bolt Adapter Flange Yoke Kit. 8L80E - Scope testing the Ford 10R80. Retiring Early The Transmission Industry Has Been a Dream Come True, A two-piece valve body with eight solenoids. This platform did not get Gen 4 (58x CKP) engines until 2008. RPO Code MF6 A more recent issue with these units is pump drive gear failure (Figure 7). Required fields are marked *. Sonnax has a line of upgrade parts that address some of the 6L80 and 6L90 transmission weaknesses. Brian at Tommy Boys Performance, however, has the opportunity to work with a local dealership assisting them when their workload gets heavy. Diagnosis and correction of a max line pressure condition may become, With Hondas 10-speed front wheel drive transmission (see Figure 1, above) going into its fifth year on the roads, its feasible that one may show up in your shop for service. For the most part, this transmission has been phased out by the 8L90E already, but is still in prodution. As the 10 speeds continue to make their way into our shops, keep in mind the more you know about them, the better off youll be. Thought's? Accelerator pedal position: Directly affects shift scheduling, TCC scheduling, and transmission diagnostics. The 10R80 transmission is a 10-speed, rear-wheel-drive transmission that is controlled by a PCM or a TCM. Genuine ICT Billet - Bolts Made in USA!!!! Special tools are often needed when diagnosing transmission problems and overhauling units. From the workshop on ongoing projects and more, and where the new images are added afterwards. Structurally, the 8L90 is similar to the 8L45, except that it is made to handle more power and torque. The ball bearing remained tight on the stator shaft support housing. The 6l80E transmission are the same through the entire line with changes made thru production in electronics. The 10R80 transmission is a 10-speed, rear-wheel-drive transmission that is controlled by a PCM or a TCM. Wait 1 second. Longitudinal transmissions [ edit] Aisin AR5/MA5 5-speed longitudinal manual made by Aisin. To view our 2020 replacement transmission pricing guide, click here. - Critical wear areas and vacuum test locations: GM 10L and Ford 10R series. Like most GM automatic transmissions, the easiest way to tell them apart is by using the pan gasket. If there are worn valves or faulty inputs or controls, its easy to see how the clutch could start to shudder and quickly fail. This drives up the price of the rebuilt converter, but ensures that this kind of failure wont happen again. Solution This 10L80 transmission problem could be the result of a failed oil cooler line fitting retaining bolt. With its 2017-2018 heralding, Ford has equipped 3 domestic models with the 10R80 transmission. Convert your american classic car with more modern technology. I am making a great deal of changes to the truck from a Procharged 5.3 to a head, cam, Fast LSXRT intake LS2 on nitrous before we build a 3.9 bore and stroke twin turbo 372ci setup. The ideal upgrade for modified performance vehicles, Sonnax 3-bolt adapter flange yoke kit T35-GMFD-01K makes it easy to convert a two-piece driveline to a one-piece, U-joint-style driveline. None of the clutch packs can engage, and there is no fail-safe operation. It is currently phasing out the 6L80/6L90 transmissions (although it hasn't done its all the way yet. The 1-piece aluminum case houses a slim 260mm 10L80 torque converter inside the integrated bell housing. Within only a year, GM had introduced an even stronger variant of the 6L80; the 6L90, RPO code MYD. I would like to keep the turbo small so it would spool extremely quickly and the compression high to be responsive. However, it is a long transmission and is not compatible with short-wheelbase Jeeps such as the CJ5. It also contains a durable transmission pan, reliable gear seat, EPC, a 13-vane pump assembly, high-performance cooler, hardened stator shaft with rings and specialized control solenoids. It would be a huge mistake not toAFM is garbage. The 6L80 was approved for use in these vehicles weighing up to 8600 lbs. The 6L80E went mostly into large vehicles with V8 motors. Your car is quick! The button for Tap control is on the top of the shifter, making it easy to use in both left and right hand drive vehicles. The overdrive ratio thats added is 0.75:1. TH400, TH200-4R, TH700-R4, 4L60, 4L60E (without converter), 6L80E Fluid capacity with 258 mm converter, 6L80E Fluid capacity with 300 mm converter, 6L90E Fluid capacity with 300 mm converter. Grade braking and clutch line pressure (for greater holding power) are additionally great features that are activated by Tow / Haul mode on the truck platforms. Click Get a Free Estimate for an unbeatable price on a replacement remanufactured transmission. Upon a test drive and a scan, code P0741 is noted and the percentage of TCC slip shows to be way out of range. Developed with upgraded internal components, Chevrolet Performance's SuperMatic 6L80-E 6-speed automatic transmission offers an exceptional torque rating of 650 lb.-ft. - a 45 percent increase over regular production versions of the 6-speed automatic. It can also be controlled under DSC, or Driver Shift Control, e.g., "tap shifting". if the car would be faster with the 6 speed auto vs the 10 speed auto. Some Tahoe and Yukon HD 6.0L, not hybrid, may also have this transmission but most have 6L80 or a 10 speed 10L80. Your email address will not be published. This transmission is the result of a collaborative effort with General Motors. The 6L80 has surprised us power transmission aficionados with its wholesale adoption of new and very different technologies. to 885 ft. and it can handle a total gross vehicle weight of 8,600 lb, which makes it a great transmission for LS swaps with no modification needed whatsoever. All I can find is that it is sealed from the rear and just needs a new tail housing but some say its got to be completely rebuilt from the inside. The 6L50, 6L80, 6L90, 8L45, 8L90, 10L60, 10L80, & 10L90 transmissions from MY2015 to current are filled through a port in the bottom of the oil pan. You will need to ship your transmission to us for the rebuild. The complaint A Ford vehicle equipped with the FNR5 transmission has a complaint of a severe slipping condition in reverse. Unlike the 4L60E and 4L80E, the 6L80 is not always referred to as with the E on the end because its been over 25 years since the last non electronic GM transmission has been in production. At times the 10-speed transmission may skip gears when the vehicle downshifts to a complete stop. The small 10-speed gear steps allow the engine speed to drop to lower values than it would in the 6-speed transmission, providing for the best fuel economy. Indirectly affects shift control. At this point, the converter rebuilder is faced with either finding another core that he hopes will have good components or purchasing a Sonnax forged cover GM-CC-13 and forged piston GM-DA-17P. I am currently planning on a high compression LS2 and a progressive nitrous kit but before another 4L80E goes in there is a 6,8, or 10 speed not an option? While working on a 2017-2018 Ford F150/Raptor, 2018 Expedition, Mustang, and Lincoln Navigator equipped with a 10R80 transmission, you may experience erratic TCC operation, or a TCC shudder concern. Transmission Pan Bolt Set Chevy 6L80E 6L90E 8L80E 8L90E 10L80E 10L90E 18pcs. Online Buyer's Guide Fits 6L80, 6L90, 8L90, 10L80 units, TR6060, TR3160 manual units. That way you get a longer service life, along with a 3-year/Unlimited Mile Nationwide Warranty.. The bottom line: The very thin (.020") woven carbon friction material cant survive the way the JMBX piston applies. Is the out put shaft and splines on a 4L80E the same as a turbo 400? Objectively, it is a fairly simple repair: simply remove the transmission pan, remove the valve body, unbolt the TEHCM from the valve body and install the new one. Indirectly affects shift pressure control. Transmission Report: 6L80, 6L90 Transmission Tech Advisory: Consider an Updated Converter in Your Next Rebuild. 3) 6L80E with fixed output flange is about 2 1/2" shorter than 4L60E and about 3 1/2" shorter than 200-4R. Comparing that to our old TH-400 combo, wed need 5.40:1 rear gear to equal the overall First Gear ratio in the new Corvette. Gilbert, Which one you use is going to depend on whether or not the transmission is in or out of the vehicle. Do you think that I might pick up a few more hundredths if I switch the lock on say when I hit second? Copyright 2023 - Transmission Repair Cost Guide. For the 4L60-E TMBX, the pistons are .115" thick, and for the 6L80, 6L90 JMBX, the pistons are significantly thicker at .150". So is the 10L90 entirely different or does it just have stronger parts? Chevrolet Transmission Dimensions Dimension "C" is the distance from the bellhousing to the center of the transmission mounting pad. lbs., with a respectable GVW of 15,000 lbs. Then to create a new Second gear, the overdrive is engaged 2.97 x 0.75 = 2.23:1. The drive gear and idler gear with the bearing are not sold separately. Will it be like the 5th gen's where the ss got the 6L80 and the more powerful ZL1 got the 6L90? Third 2.15 If youre having problems with your 10L80 youre going to want the most economical solution. Concerns can range from any of the following: These drivability concerns can be mistaken for transmission malfunctions. The Ford 10R80 has a fill plug and dipstick on the passenger side of the case like the 6R80 transmission. Fluid Capacity 13 qts, First 4.70 Thx What is most welcome about it is that it is a very durable, functional and impressive transmission assembly and appears to have a terrific prospect with GM and the aftermarket community. Drive the vehicle until the engine and transmission reach normal operating temperature. Will it be like the 5th gen's where the ss got the 6L80 and the more powerful ZL1 got the 6L90? I see where Summit Racing lists a TCI transmission that was originally a 4L80E but they list it as a six-speed transmission. Wait 2 seconds. The same shift strategy that is used for the upshift may be applied during a downshift. To be honest, we arent 100% sure of the real reason for JMBX cover and piston failure, but we do have a theory. Check out delicious pictures and movies from Peter Mrup, Dennis Andersson and Svein Pedersen. See the pictures below to help you tell if you have the right transmission. The 6L80 began manufacture in 2005 for release in 2006 model year GM vehicles, persisting until at least 2016 in both 6L80 and 6L90 versions. Always inspect the sump for possible evidence of debris that could indicate the pump drive gears could be failing. We are High Performance Transmission Builders full. The 10L90 and 10L80 10 Speed Automatic Transmissions are on exchange through GM PQC as part of our ongoing quality improvement efforts to assist Engineering with product concern identification effective on 02/13/16. By the time a converter rebuilder opens up a JMBX, the damage is done, and it can be hard to see what happened first. document.write("- "+yr); *$3,245 does not include any Hard Part damage, Torque Converter or TCM/ECM tuning. Reverse 4.87. Chevrolet, Buick & GM Engines into the Jeep Ford 1.8L - 2.5L "Pinto" Engines into the Jeep 4L60E (and its tougher 4L65 & 4L70 variants). Jeff Smith: The TCI six-speed automatic is indeed a revamped or upgraded 4L80E. LS 3 has a Big Turbo on it, I am only worried about rear gear, rest I have help with, Car never went over 130 or it red lined with Big Block, Never was a highway car, It has a 373 or a 323 in it, Not a 411 I know that much, Thats all, Im building a gen one Camaro and Ive purchased lt4 supercharged motor for it I was wanting to know if you know the difference in size for 10 speed transmission to a turbo 400 I need to know how much to raise my floor pan at tunnel and about how much fire wall to cut out. DESIGNED FOR GEN V LT1 & LT4 ONLY. So my suggestion is to not subject the lockup to that amount of abuse. I have a 2012 Corvette Grand Sport Auto trans. After a prolonged drive time, DTC P0752 Pressure Control Solenoid A - Stuck On and P0973 Pressure Control Solenoid A - Circuit Low also set. With a dry weight of approximately 230 lbs, its also very light considering the complexity. Thanks for the question! Its been on the road for a few years, and were starting to see some common failures for this unit. Most full-size trucks and SUVs with a 6L80, 6L90 use a JMBX full-size (300mm) style converter. However some 2wd vans and HD truck versions had a, J Series Trucks & Wagons, (I6 * WILL ALLOW USE . Maximum engine input torque for the 6L80 is 440 ft. lbs. * 10L90E TRANSMISSION. TAP-2000 is a floor mounted shifter with Tap up Tap Down for GM 6/8L80/90E transmissions. Gears Magazine The 4L60E was the first generation of transmission to work with a Gen III Vortec or LS motor. August 8, 2022. Your cooperation with this program is greatly appreciated. If the transmission fluid is discolored or has evidence of debris in the fluid, it would be recommended to replace the torque converter and flush the system to complete this repair. Im not tuned ( not yet anyway), however, if I knew then what I know today, I probably would have went for the M6. 1. I'd be modding it to a FBO car with cam and converter eventually. Most of us have either seen or heard of the new 10-speed transmission Ford is offing behind the 2.3L EcoBoost, 2.7L V6, 3.5L EcoBoost, 5.0L gas, and 3.0L Power Stroke Diesel engines. In the TMBX, the damper is on the transmission side of the clutch piston, and in the JMBX, the damper is located on the engine side of the piston. Thanks Jeff. Comparing the two cross sections, you also quickly see that the orientation of the spring dampers is different. The transmission lacks a direct-drive, but features two overdrive gears. I am interested in enhancing my vehicles performance. You also asked about GMs new 6L80E. In 2018 and later models with the transmission warmer mounted to the transmission, there can be a concern with coolant leaking under the vehicle. Thats pretty much all thats to it. Starting in 1996, many 4L60E transmissions employed a bolt-on bellhousing. Shift the transmission to Neutral. A horsepower revolution spawned by GM's increasingly powerful Gen. III+ V8 engines and their aggressive platforms such as the Cadillac STSV, XLRV, various trucks and SUV's and the venerable Corvette. Its valuable to know that the debris you are seeing in the pans of all of those 6L80 and 6L90 units is very often from converter failure. lost energy) are reduced by only having two of the six clutches open at any time. We pride ourselves in staying at the forefront of our industry, technology, research & development and our commitment to you, our customer. Then, of course, Sixth gear is still 0.75:1 overdrive. Foremost on the list is the Sonnax clutch apply kit. For both types A and B, a freeze-frame record will be stored in memory if the MIL illuminates. This means that its designed for rear wheel drive vehicles only. Thanks to the optimal gear spacing, the engine RPM only drops approximately 20% when the 10L80 changes gear. But in the 6L80 JMBX, we started to look very closely at the converter itself to see if we could determine a root cause. or gross weight of 14,000 lbs. Page 2 August, 2019 Bulletin No. (incl. _____ HBM 2016 2SS A8 NPP Pray . Joined Feb 11, 2007 Messages 11 Location . This is both a return to and a departure from previous automotive control systems in the industry in that earlier electronic transmissions used a separate control module, later to be integrated into the Engine Control Modules which were thus termed Powertrain Control Modules. The 10R80 doesn't have a traditional "front" pump. In any event, precise coordinate measuring (CMM scans) of a variety of JMBX covers shows that the covers are wavy and have undulations on the clutch surface, especially opposite of the welded cover pads. should check for clearance. 6L80/6L90/8L90/10L90 AN Transmission Cooler Manifold Our Price: $150.00 Out of stock We now offer a convenient AN trans cooler manifold solution for the 6L80, 6L90, 8L90, and 10L90 transmission. Inspect the warmer for damage and related lines for leaks (Figure 4). Powertrain Expo Customers' pictures and movies from drag racing competitions. Hi, im doing a swap from Yukon 2019 to 1987 Regal. Commanded engine torque: Directly affects shift scheduling, TCC scheduling, and transmission diagnostics. The 4L80E is a very large, heavy transmission but, like its original TH-400 cousin, it can absorb and transmit an enormous amount of engine torque. Mine did it on flat ground only it downshifted four or more gears with a loud bang then jumped back up to tenth with the same bang. You know where this is going yup, its the converter. Dimension "C" is the distance from the bellhousing to the center of the transmission mounting pad. The overall First gear ratio is 2.48 x 4.10 = 10.17:1. Shift stabilization is achieved through these and similar strategies. Note: The mounting pad is usually a part of the extension housing, but the graphic shows it on the maine case. GM LS1 - LS9 / Chrysler Gen III and Viper V10, Conversion. Its a little tough to see, but the thickness of the pistons is also different. As these units accumulate more mileage, these concerns may become more frequent. You also asked about GM's new 6L80E. Based around the 4L80E (and fitting wherever a 4L80E will fit), the 6X is a true six-speed transmission that TCI rates at 850-plus horsepower. This is a normal and desired behavior. Legal/Privacy. At part pedal, when acceleration is brisk, single-step upshifts would result in very frequent shift events (a very short time in gear). Helping transmission shops achievesuccessful and profitable operation. We Specialize In: GM LS Conversions Engine & Trans Combo Kits Unique Ready to Run Engines Have a question? If you know the RPO code for the transmission you are golden. Note, some customers may complain of a converter type whine noise coming from the transmission. Aisin AY6 6-speed longitudinal manual made by Aisin. These concerns may be caused by a sticking TCC Regulator Valve (Figure 5). Had transmission rebuilt (Pro).My problem is that when it gets around 35, 8L90E Specs, Performance, and Identification, TH400 Transmission Specs, ID, and Common Problems, Mazda 6 P0320: Meaning, Causes, & Diagnosis. Shop Finder Engine torque rating increases minimally, but the output torque rating of the transmission jumps up by nearly 220 ft. lbs. The 6L80 was, from the ground up, developed as an electric over hydraulic transmission with microprocessor control. It is a heavy duty version of the 6L80 six speed automatic with a strengthened input gearset which has two additional pinion gears for six total and a strengthened output gearset that uses wider gears than the 6L80. Before answering that question, its worth noting the role that Sonnax plays in the converter rebuilding business.
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